Member Discussions

The Binary Forge is pleased to announce the development of a new text-based online role-playing game, Maiden Desmodus.

Set in an original world with a fantasy horror theme and powered by a custom game engine, Maiden Desmodus will offer an intense multiplayer role-playing environment.

When the Kneyan Kingdom was conquered a hundred years ago and the Kneyan people of the mainland exterminated, The Isle became an independent kingdom. With the trade routes decimated by war, the Kneyans of The Isle settled into a peaceful and self-reliant existence. That is, until the arrival of a dark being that came to be known by the islanders as the Maiden Desmodus.

The Maiden Desmodus, described as a witch by some, a vampire or demon by others, began feeding off of the population. Great efforts were made to slay the Maiden, yet all were futile. In time, the Kneyans forged an unspoken truce with "The Crimson Goddess" and blood was soon being offered in worship at temples throughout The Isle.

However, a rebellion against the practices of traditional Desmoduism led to the fracturing of the Kneyan Kingdom, and now the emerging Kingdom of Thiria wages a brutal war with their former brothers to the south.

Key game features will include description driven character interaction, non automated combat, a player driven economy with extensive crafting, mass warfare and conquest, player run factions and political intrigue, hundreds of unique skills to learn, all original areas to explore including instanced adventure zones... and much much more.

Visit the website at www.maidendesmodus.com and join the forums for the latest development news including openings for staff and playtesters.

I get a serious Blood Dusk vibe from what I can see of this mud so far. And that is a good thing. Good luck with the mud!

This is not an original game engine.

It's quite obvious that this has been derived from the Harshlands/Forever's End/Shadows of Isildur RPI codeline as the number of similarities between the two are astounding.

Why haven't you given credit to the coders who have worked so diligently over the years on these codebases?

Is it because you plan on charging in a credit-based system, and you know that the license agreements set forward by the DIKU team, as well as the subsequent coders that worked on this codebase, would never allow it?

The game engine is an original work derived from NakedMud by Geoff Hollis and SocketMud by Brian Graversen. This is clearly stated on our website and also on our login screen.

I am happy to submit the code for review by an independent authority to confirm that this is the case, after which I will expect a public apology and a full retraction of your allegations.

If I'm wrong, I'll be happy to apologize. As per independent authority, I'd suggest KaVir, who has had extensive experience in resolving these disputes in the past.

Don't let yourself get bullied into submitting your code just because some people made accusations (no offense to EFalconer, whom I'm sure is operating in good faith). If you're innocent, you shouldn't feel like you have to submit your code or justify yourself to anyone.

--matt

Don't let yourself get bullied into submitting your code just because some people made accusations (no offense to EFalconer, whom I'm sure is operating in good faith). If you're innocent, you shouldn't feel like you have to submit your code or justify yourself to anyone.

I agree, and I would also argue that EFalconer was took an unwarranted hostile tone.

I think it'd be far more fair to post the similarities if a public accusation like this is going to be made. It's easy to throw out an accusation from the hip, but what is the evidence?

It's quite obvious that this has been derived from the Harshlands/Forever's End/Shadows of Isildur RPI codeline as the number of similarities between the two are astounding.

Just because the game engine shares a lot of similarities with some other engines does not automatically mean there is foul play going on.

Over the years i have had many people comment on how aspects of my game are similar to some ROM muds. That alone is enough to scare me as its a Smaug derivative and they are like chalk and cheese.

To the OP, i agree with Matt's view on things, you do not need to vindicate yourself when there is no evidence to support any wrong doing on your part.

Oh, and good luck with your game, if i get a chance later this week i will drop in and take a look myself.

If you are still willing to submit the code, I offer myself as an third party to review it. I also have access to the Shadows Of Isildur codebase and if there is anything in Falconer's claim, it'd be apparent pretty quickly. The reason I post this is that Falconer drew attention to his claims on our forums and while I'm not jumping to conclusions, it does look a little 'Harshlands' from the small things I've seen so far.

There are a good thirty similarities I noticed when browsing the Maiden forums from my own experience with SoI/FEM/Harshlands. As we move forward, I'll be glad to provide further evidence, but I'll simply start with this:

OUTPUT FROM SHADOWS OF ISILDUR - CHARACTER CREATION:

Select the physical aspects of your character's body. This is broken down into two basic catagories; frame and height, and will be used for sizing the various equipment found in the game. Size will also be used for determining modifiers to your character, such as weight.

Please note that both aspects are relative to your character's race; to many a Hobbit's chagrin, they just don't measure up to the Haradrim!

Please type the height and frame on one line, using the list below.

Heights - Short, Average, Tall
Frames - Scant, Light, Medium, Heavy, Massive

Examples:

>short heavy
>tall scant

FROM THE MAIDEN DESMODUS CHARACTER GENERATION

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

What are the physical aspects of your character?

The physical aspects of your character are height and frame. These two aspects determine your character's weight, description when cloaked or masked, and what sizes of clothing and equipment can be worn. Enter your chosen height and frame on a single line.

Heights -- short, average, tall
Frames -- scant, light, medium, heavy, massive

Examples:

> short scant
> tall massive

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Enter your physical aspects and press ENTER:

I've played a lot of muds spanning many different codebases, and there's almost always going to be some degree of similarity. I could point out a lot of similarities between, say Quake and Doom (I guess that dates me), but that doesn't mean one company stole code from the other. More often than not, games within the same genre - in this case, muds - are going to look at least vaguely familiar.

I just hope we don't start seeing stuff like "OMG I saw a mud that has the look, score and who commandz, and my mud has them! u stole my code u n00b!" ;)

Cosmetic similarities with Forever's End and Shadows of Isildur may be due to him working with Wade Gustafson, who has experience as a mud administrator and world builder on games such as Forever’s End and Shadows of Isildur.

http://bc-dev.net/2008/07/10/maiden-desmodus/

They used some of the same terms, but how is that indicative of it being a stolen engine? The words are content, easily created anew. Any MUD could make their creation look like that. No biggie.

Ennius wrote:

I could point out a lot of similarities between, say Quake and Doom (I guess that dates me), but that doesn't mean one company stole code from the other.

Wellllll.....that's because the same company made both Doom and Quake. ;) id Software - http://www.idsoftware.com

Wellllll.....that's because the same company made both Doom and Quake. ;)

OK fine, bad example. :) Swap out Doom for Duke Nukem 3D (I have to choose a game that's equally dated, of course!).

If you don't remember those games, I'd almost feel sorry for you missing out on them.

If this is supposed to prove that your accusation contains any truth...

Then by all means you have proved SOI being a cheap hack of pre-dating
muds which share this aspect.

Wipe your behind after you take a dump.
Not before.

(Think before you post, not after)

(Comment added by Fishy on Wed Jul 16 11:59:44 2008)

was supposed to contain a quote from that comparison of char creation....

If you don't remember those games, I'd almost feel sorry for you missing out on them.

I was way too into those old FPS games. I even played the fringe ones like Rise of the Triads!

If anyone was wondering how this issue was resolved, some code samples were seen by a member of staff on the Shadows of Isildur mud that uses the RPI engine. She had this to say on their forums:

I've been in contact with Matt Adcock and I've reviewed a sample of their code - there is no funny business going on. Not only is the Maiden Desmodus in a different programming language, it's in a different programming STYLE. The outputs may be similar, but it's unique 'behind the scenes' and I wish both Wade and Matt well on the project.

In response Falconer then posted this apology and retraction:

I'm not too proud to issue a distinct and public mea culpa, here. While I believe that the vast number of similarities between the output of the RPI engine and the output of Maiden Desmodus warranted a deeper look, this is a lesson in not judging the book by the cover.

To Wade and his colleagues working on Maiden Desmodus: I apologize for jumping to conclusions. The best of luck on your project.

I posted my original thoughts on the matter here.

Development work is still continuing; new skills and features are being added and new parts of the world are being built. We will be announcing a release schedule and some planned phases of testing soon, so be sure to visit the forums for all the latest news.