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Author Topic: Defining the differences of MUDs  (Read 1385 times)

Epilogy

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #30 on: January 08, 2017, 5:33 PM »
Excellent idea!  Maybe they could answer my questions even further.  ^_^


You'll just need the gather the souls of 1000 newbies, climb the highest mountain, and feed the beast that lies at the peak so that he might send out the roar of summons...

But in all seriousness, I really do think this should be done. If no one else will do it...

I am afraid of heights, but the souls should be no problem.  ^_^

And who are these old ones you speak of?  Prior creators or residents of TMC or are we talking MUDs in general?

There's a lot of crusty old coders. You'll have to ply them with tiger balm and coffee, but they might be convinced to get all anachronistic and rosy eyed. Getting them to get along with each other long enough to get a decent view of history, though would probably be more difficult.

MUDPlayer

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #31 on: January 09, 2017, 12:26 AM »

There's a lot of crusty old coders. You'll have to ply them with tiger balm and coffee, but they might be convinced to get all anachronistic and rosy eyed. Getting them to get along with each other long enough to get a decent view of history, though would probably be more difficult.

If you are at all serious in this endeavor, the queation is will this be something we are expecting them to do totally for free out of the kindness of their hearts and for academic/historical reasons, or paid by us to have this hosted only on TMC, or will this be a coffee table book with sales much like Half Life 2's Raising the Bar where they get paid from the sales?  Or I suppose even a vblog, are they called?  This is of course if you are actually serious about this.
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Jindrak

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #32 on: January 09, 2017, 12:31 AM »
There's a lot of crusty old coders. You'll have to ply them with tiger balm and coffee, but they might be convinced to get all anachronistic and rosy eyed.

A case or two of Monster and Sugar Free Red Bull works also...

Getting them to get along with each other long enough to get a decent view of history, though would probably be more difficult.

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Hades_Kane

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #33 on: January 09, 2017, 10:45 AM »
Then by all means... write one up :)
ha! I love this!

very disappointing...


What's disappointing is someone asking a question, not liking the answer s/he gets, despite it being well reasoned, then expecting others to do work to improve upon the answer, whilst being unwilling to put forth the effort on his/her own part.

If I had all the answers I would of simply posted them here to help others, opposed to having to ask.

No one here has "all the answers."

Anyone attempting to comprise a comprehensive list of the genealogy of MUDs along with a feature list and list of differences between the branches and the derivatives and off-shoots of branches has a long, long road ahead of them with A LOT of research ahead of them.

Some of the "old ones" may be able to offer some insight in how a few things branched off, but I'd wager their input wouldn't encompass the feature list you are looking for, nor would it likely be much more than one could gather on their own after an afternoon of crawling through the web doing their own research.

You said before:
"I still do not see the reason for such objections to a more comprehensive one.  It is not like I am asking for something unreasonable."

Considering you are asking for someone else to do work that you are full well capable of doing yourself, then yes, you kind of are asking for something unreasonable.  Its unreasonable to say "I'm capable of this, but don't want to because I'd rather someone else do the work" and no matter who you would put to the task, this is a lot of work.

No one is "objecting" to having a more comprehensive list... what people are objecting to is you pushing the work onto them instead of taking on the endeavor yourself.  If you feel such a list would be that valuable and you want such a list that bad, then by all means, go for it.  No one will stand in your way, no one will "object" and I'm sure plenty of people would be happy to help you along, give you pointers, their own bit of knowledge, or point you to the right places to look for the information.

I still do not see the reason for such objections to you crafting a more comprehensive one.  It is not like I am asking for something unreasonable.
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MUDPlayer

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #34 on: January 09, 2017, 5:20 PM »
Then by all means... write one up :)
ha! I love this!

very disappointing...


What's disappointing is someone asking a question, not liking the answer s/he gets, despite it being well reasoned, then expecting others to do work to improve upon the answer, whilst being unwilling to put forth the effort on his/her own part.

If I had all the answers I would of simply posted them here to help others, opposed to having to ask.

No one here has "all the answers."

Anyone attempting to comprise a comprehensive list of the genealogy of MUDs along with a feature list and list of differences between the branches and the derivatives and off-shoots of branches has a long, long road ahead of them with A LOT of research ahead of them.

Some of the "old ones" may be able to offer some insight in how a few things branched off, but I'd wager their input wouldn't encompass the feature list you are looking for, nor would it likely be much more than one could gather on their own after an afternoon of crawling through the web doing their own research.

You said before:
"I still do not see the reason for such objections to a more comprehensive one.  It is not like I am asking for something unreasonable."

Considering you are asking for someone else to do work that you are full well capable of doing yourself, then yes, you kind of are asking for something unreasonable.  Its unreasonable to say "I'm capable of this, but don't want to because I'd rather someone else do the work" and no matter who you would put to the task, this is a lot of work.

No one is "objecting" to having a more comprehensive list... what people are objecting to is you pushing the work onto them instead of taking on the endeavor yourself.  If you feel such a list would be that valuable and you want such a list that bad, then by all means, go for it.  No one will stand in your way, no one will "object" and I'm sure plenty of people would be happy to help you along, give you pointers, their own bit of knowledge, or point you to the right places to look for the information.

I still do not see the reason for such objections to you crafting a more comprehensive one.  It is not like I am asking for something unreasonable.

With all due respect I have searched and continue to search the net and have not/am not finding what I am looking for.  Considering this is a rather large and one of the best (THE best in my humble and honest opinion.) MUD websites and with people who have either been in the business or have played them for many years, decades even, I figured there would be people knowledgable on the subject and would have a comprehensive list or could at least direct me to one.  That does not sound too unreasonable.

By asking for more the list has already gotten bigger.  I appreciate what you and others have put forth, but if you simply have exhausted your wisdom, then there is no reason for you or anyone else to bother more.  Let some one else who does and cares to, give more.

I would prefer to keep this on topic before it gets locked down, with the exception of the idea of getting The Old Ones together if that is even feasible.  Thank you.  (Thess quotes are getting long. ^_^)
« Last Edit: January 09, 2017, 5:30 PM by MUDPlayer »
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Lyanic

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #35 on: January 09, 2017, 8:58 PM »
Maybe MUD Archaeology is the answer after all. Quick, someone start developing a sentient AI that conducts research on topics of historical human niche interests.

Ateraan

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #36 on: January 09, 2017, 10:00 PM »
I really don't get what all the hubbub is about. I've been into text games for beyond 2 decades and graphic games prior and during that. I have seen little to give me the impression that much has changed with either other than better operating systems.

MUDPlayer,

The reason all of the long timers are kind of razzing you is because you are the 1st or the 1st I've seen that can't find the game you are looking for with all the resources and definitions and active games at your fingertips. It is highly likely everyone thinks you are just vying for attention and treating you as such.

This is entirely my opinion, however, so take it as you will. Happy game hunting!
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Hades_Kane

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2017, 11:02 AM »
It is highly likely everyone thinks you are just vying for attention and treating you as such.

I'm not taking it like that.

It's more akin to people who start their own MUDs, don't know how to code or build, and then just wants everyone else to do all the code/build work for them when they could learn how to do it themselves.

I believe that he believes that a few of us are just sitting ontop of that information in an easily digestible form, and doesn't realize that anyone trying to undertake this has as much work in front of them as he would if he were to do it himself, because the vast majority of us who have been around in the community or working on MUDs for 20 years or more (myself included) might have some rudimentary knowledge, off hand, on how MUDs developed and came about, and a little bit of the genealogy of them, but the majority of us have spent our time huddled in one small corner of the dozens of codebases out there (and that's those of us that haven't spent the majority of that time developing something custom or original).

He's asked "why the objection" and other stuff... he seems genuinely confused as to why there are naysayers on the idea, and why no one wants to take him up on his idea.

Again, it reminds me very much of someone saying "But I have a GREAT idea for a MUD, how come no one wants to code it for me?"

I've overspent my energy trying to paint a realistic picture as to why this is such a massive undertaking, why its extremely unlikely and unreasonable to expect someone else to do the work he wants done.  And that's really been my agenda... "here's why you shouldn't expect this to materialize..."
« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 11:14 AM by Hades_Kane »
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Hades_Kane

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2017, 11:09 AM »
With all due respect I have searched and continue to search the net and have not/am not finding what I am looking for.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MUD
Pay particular attention to the "spread" and read the individual "main article" sections for the main branches.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MUDs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MUD_trees

http://www.topmudsites.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5708

https://www.reddit.com/r/MUD/comments/13jzi2/muds_mushs_and_moos_whats_the_difference/

One of the previously mentioned "old ones" (Scandum) already started, to a degree, on some sort of list of codebases and some notes on them.
http://www.mudpedia.org/mediawiki/index.php/Category:Codebases

http://www.mudpedia.org/mediawiki/index.php/Comparison_of_MUD_codebases

http://www.andreasen.org/newmud/
-Diablos
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RahjIII

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2017, 11:27 AM »
Can I be An Old One?  I really want to be An Old One.   Ask me anything.  I'll promise to tell you how much better things used to be when it was just us Elder Things, and I'll tell you again and again about that time I forced young Cthulhu himself off my lawn using a 300 baud acoustic modem if you'll just let me be An Old One.   ;)
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Epilogy

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2017, 5:25 PM »
Can I be An Old One?  I really want to be An Old One.   Ask me anything.  I'll promise to tell you how much better things used to be when it was just us Elder Things, and I'll tell you again and again about that time I forced young Cthulhu himself off my lawn using a 300 baud acoustic modem if you'll just let me be An Old One.   ;)

I guess it depends.

Do you not only have multiple code submissions used by a lot (relative) of people, but also a 10% discount at the grocery store on Wednesday?

Ateraan

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2017, 8:44 PM »
Can I be An Old One?  I really want to be An Old One.   Ask me anything.  I'll promise to tell you how much better things used to be when it was just us Elder Things, and I'll tell you again and again about that time I forced young Cthulhu himself off my lawn using a 300 baud acoustic modem if you'll just let me be An Old One.   ;)
The answer is this: If you must ask, no you may not.:P
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Hades_Kane

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #42 on: January 11, 2017, 10:54 AM »
Remember Osiris?

That guy was entertaining.
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Ateraan

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2017, 1:52 AM »
Can't remember that one. The person I remember from the early 2000's that was funny was Delerak, but I think he was mostly on Top Mud Sites.
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Molly

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Re: Defining the differences of MUDs
« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2017, 8:53 AM »
Osiris was extremely funny, but I don't think everyone appreciated it, since he was also a bit of a troll.
I remember when he marketed his Mud by offering free nude pictures of his wife to new players.

Some posters here on TMCwere really affronted by it, but like most of Osiris'  gags it was just trolling.

I really miss that guy. I've always had an affinity for funny trolls...
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